ARAWYNMOLAINE, its not, but if you reside within the USA, you may file a small claim for the maximum amount.
@ClairabusGryff My boyfriend who is several levels below me lost nothing, got 117 red books and barely does fortresses and received a lot of extra fragments including severes and emergencies. As a tangible example he noticed yesterday he has 4 new Ministry Newts he shouldn’t have gotten having just prestiged the page pre update. The rest of my community thinks they got the right fragments or excess so I think the majority are fine as they say
I lost fragments when it initially happened. I lost dumbledore portraits, pensive, firenze, and dragon eggs. I lost hundreds of books, joke products, and symbols. Challenge fragments don't really count as lost though. All you lost is the opportunity to click over and over again to get a bunch of books that others players had and it's not clear that was intended. Those challenge fragments are easily replaced as the most you will need is 25. @BenTiger @MrMasterMiltank
It definitely sucks that players lost a bunch of fragments. The sad truth is that they cannot spend the resources to fix it. You can post all of the fixes on earth you think you can do, but you probably are not aware of any constraints they have in place. The fragments are not coming back. Players need to accept that and move on.
@rocketj The fragments that require you to earn them through challenges are not easily replaced. Odds of getting them are 1/3 to 1/5... when they appear. Do low level forts and those odds drop to 1/20. Do high level forts and the odds get better.
So, to recover just those fragments it will take thousands of runestones and weeks to months of challenges.
Challenge fragments are also not as easy as you say to replace. To earn 25 of a specific fragment can take hundreds of challenges. Higher level challenges take over five minutes. Now, that is hundreds of hours! Add the time it takes just to load challenges with the current delay bug and the time it takes to get a group for higher level challenges. How is that easy?
Now... add in the time it takes to craft positions that are required to do high level traces. Unless you purchase the hundreds of potions that will be needed to do the traces, that is months worth of waiting on potions.
So... explain to me how that is not something to be upset about.
because there were several bugs, there is no way to really identify who didn’t lose a single fragment and who did. For example, while the fix “worked” for me for the most part, I still lost hundreds of fragments and for a while, my game was basically unplayable, and I wasn’t able to play or catch many severe and emergency foundables that I would have. Others retained their green stars, but the first fix didn’t for them. For some, the first fix worked, but then they lost their stars, etc.
Frankly, those arguing that they should be the only ones to get an apology pack in a game where PVP isn’t a thing sound rather selfish to me. Pretty much everyone was affected in some way or another. I’m not downplaying what happened to everyone, it really stinks and I wish all of us had ALL of our stuff back..what I am saying is that realistically, it seems like an unreasonable request. If they can’t go back and fix the fragments one by one, they’re definitely not going to be able to assess one by one who gets how much of an apology pack.
I‘d still advocate for placing green stars on everyone’s pages, but I do understand the fear of further messing things up given that it didn’t go well the first time and I respect not wanting to repeat a mistake and risk causing even more damage.
@BenTiger - sorry to have missed your thread that got deleted. it must have hit too close to home.
@MrMasterMiltank Good advice, I think I will. Two accounts hit in our family, definitely worth the trouble.
apple and google already denied us.
@hpwulola - The screenshot below proves that developers can in fact go into individual players' registries. All I want back are my Oddities. That's it. My "seen" numbers prove how many I have encountered. That's all I want back. I busted my rear on the Poacher event a few weeks back and got over 100 doxies during that time. I just want my Oddities fragments back. I can earn all the other pages back but because Doxies only appear around dawn that's cruel and unusual punishment to get those fragments back. Please, I beg you. Oddities don't spawn often around here. Just give me those? Please? My in game name is Lioness Molly (with a space between Lioness and Molly) . My forum name doesn't have the space. Just FOR THE LOVE OF EVERYTHING WARN ME FIRST SO I CAN LOG OUT PROPERLY!!!! OR- Give us another event like the Poacher event. Heck, give us another go around of the Poacher event. It was fun as heck (side note- The ONLY Poacher I saw was Doxies. Other people saw different ones that I never did, maybe tweak the spawn rate of different kinds of poachers?) and I had a lot of fun playing it.... until all my fragments disappeared. Another Poacher event won't bring back what I lost, but it'll at least give me the chance to replace it all.
“ We must choose between what is right and what is easy.”
Unfortunately, Niantic and WB did not learn from the very best. They chose the easy way out. It is no wonder why the rest of the people are happy. It is because of all the free packs they get at the expense of us.
I wonder if John Hanke is aware, or even cares anymore what happens with his company's games. He used to be much more involved in day to day ops back when Ingress was picking up steam.
Oh well, it's a pretty decent **** to the HPWU community. At a time when lots of interesting stuff should be happening (current brilliant challenge is hinting at some interesting story points). Much like when Ingress came out, they had many directions they could go, and they did somewhat listen to the dedicated players (I miss the research board and hunting for and deciphering the puzzles so much, and 90% of the players had no idea about that...). Ingress had a circle of players in Google+ who would be visited by the red queen, white rabbit, and Cheshire cat. It was a ton of fun, any many of the real world events grew from those interactions.
It would be good if the @HPWUTeam would tap into their player community more, involve is in some decisions, maybe get ideas on what the pain points are. We're your front line. We are (and some were at this point) your most dedicated resource.
My biggest issue, even though losing hundreds of fragments sucked, was that you didn't learn from your first mistake. Changes were made unannounced, and when an issue was discovered, you did not use the in-game communication tool, which led the issue to multiply. You guys really need to do a root cause analysis on your change process, and make sure you have back out plans in place. Above all else, you need to use your proper channels of communication, especially when something is system wide. And don't be afraid to hit the off button! I'd rather be down an hour than go through losing everything again.
@SaylerA @MissyWuwu The data must be of two sorts: Fixed and Transient
For Fixed this would include XP, Level, ingredients, potions, runes etc. From what I have seen on this forum and elsewhere, all of these values have been preserved correctly
For Transient this would include fragment count, and this is where the issue arose. With only 2 snapshots with weeks in between it is impossible to figure out how many Images were prestiged with XP collected and seemingly correctly recorded
If your assertion that it is possible to correct the issue by a simple database comparison is correct then it would have been done by now. Occams **** applies - the simplest solution to any problem is always the right answer
FYI I have been hands-on developing Oracle and now Snowflake database applications since 1993 so I do know what I am talking about, alternatively I have left a trail of destruction across the 38 predominantly blue chip financial institutions I have worked at over the past 27 years
Clearly there is a data gap ie the database does not store full history, and it’s true I am inferring some behaviour from the limited information available
One thing I have learnt is that it is very easy to imagine a fix without full knowledge and a lack of real world experience of what is possible and what isn’t
Evidence matters and in this case the developers aren’t going to expose the true root cause because that would be far too embarrassing and further damaging to the product as all the haters jump on the bandwagon again
What is important right now is we accept there has been a ****-up, take a deep breath, and get on with it. We either carry on playing or give up, because shouting isn’t going to fix the problem
I have already taken a deep breath and decided to keep on playing. But only because I enjoy playing with friends.
What irritates me most is the lack of "we screwed up big time some of our players and we have taken steps to improve from now on".
If I have to read pr talk / spin doctoring / **** like this (quote from HPWULola)
"To clarify, we will not be doing a fix or anything that impacts players' individual registries. I apologize that this does not answer every players' frustrations, but we hope to move forward and make it up to you with future events and content."
and afterwards hear my friends praising Niantic/WB for being generous again with the make up gift, I'll propably quit. It's hard enough to bite my tongue and not to ruin the mood among us even now.
@Kellerrys - I didn’t recommend biting your tongue, that would be painful!
Seriously, enough is enough, we have to move on and get over this mess. I understand the anger and frustrations but the only people suffering are those expressing anger and frustration, no-one else cares, there are only so many spleens to vent
Its a game. Nobody died. No-one got hurt
So let’s move on with what we have
@rocketj You should examine what happens if you give a random pair of people $100 to split, no work in return required other than the following. One of them first has to decide how the split is to be done, and the other then gets to decide if any of them is going to get anything at all. No negotiation allowed.
There is a point where the second person just says "no way, you are way too gready" and both get to walk away empty handed. Where exactly that tripping point is, is of course different for different people, but it is there for everybody. Yes, this might seem childish at first glance, but this is actually part of human nature, and is something that for a looooong time has helped us humans work together in a "you scratch my back, I'll scratch yours" kind of way.
It appears that what has been offered activates this mechanism, and that people are simply calling out on an unnegotiated unilateral deal that they think smells from miles away.
Sorry for being a human.
Too bad I don't have another 150 runestones to grind to place wild boar again! One of at least a dozen fortress foundables that I had grinded to place on a silver page. No hope at being able to prestige, it'll take me another 6 months to earn the runestones back. You see the problem here, and why a free pack won't fix things? Level 51 everyday player since launch. Seems like all your most hardcore everyday players are the ones that got screwed the most by this.
To those who just want to move on etc, it's great if you can accept the loss or maybe didn't lose anything.
So what's the harm in letting those people who are pissed off go on? It literally doesn't affect you personally right? Just like how people say it should not matter if everyone else gets the same compensation pack, since the game isn't a competition etc.
If it doesn't matter what others get, it shouldn't matter what others post in a game forum. Why engage? We all need to vent when we're angry, and being told that our anger is somehow not valid does not help at all. If you're okay with the situation, then you're in acalmer state of mind, and you should be more tolerant of others who are upset and angry
We were not talking about fragments but a green star, which is nothing more than a flag - set or unset.
All they had to do is set the flag again if it was set in the backup and the prestige level of the page did not change in between.
They simply don't want to spend any time on it because other issues are likely to generate more profit. That is understandable but nothing I will ever accept as unchangeable.
Personally I gave my green stars lost pretty soon. I didn't like the enormous progress after the update (even though I prestiged right away). What hurt most was the loss of goals when all families went 65*. Losing the green stars was some almost welcomed compensation for that.
Whoever thinks this can't be fixed properly, ask any banking database admin if it can be fixed. There are literrally millions of databases in the world with data integrity. Why does Niantic think they have the only one that can lose data? They have all the data they need, just junior level db admins that are already looking for a new job.
I’m not sure anyone has said your anger is not valid, I think it is @littlestinky Had I lost pages instead of only fragments, I would have yelled and quit the game. I wouldn’t continue to yell about it though.
They are not going to return the fragments for whatever reason. Hours, cost, difficulty, whatever the reason, they aren’t. This needs to be accepted. Yelling about it on a forum is not going to change this. Getting a refund, giving it a bad rating, uninstalling the game, telling your friends not to start playing, these are things to do.
@LionessMolly I wholeheartedly agree, please redo another poacher event, to replace Oddities... I lost Doxies, I was on a Bronze frame and had placed the 25 needed at the time as I am not a morning person. Felt very pleased with myself! Now I have 0/25 my seen count is 156. I lost Vampires (haven't prestiged that page yet but had placed enough prior to 'fixes'. I'm now on 0/9 but seen 84. I lost Chinese Fireballs, seen 14 now on 1/3 Standard frame, (this hit hard as I am from the UK). I lost Horned Serpents, currently on Bronze frame as 0/5 (seen 75). I don't have screenshots or spreadsheets but I'm glad as I feel it would only serve to highlight the true extent of my losses. There's more Oddity losses, I haven't mentioned and that's only one Family. Feeling very deflated.
@SaylerA - I am a banking DBA, Developer, Data Architect. Actually, more than that, but it doesn’t matter really, you are making a huge assumption the transaction data is available, and from what we know, it isn’t, there are two (or more) point in time snapshots and nothing in between
A little knowledge is dangerous
None of us are fully aware of the exact situation so most comments are pure speculation. Feel free to ignore any of my posts, there is a forum option somewhere
I am disappointed in the communication for this whole process. Like many, I was negatively affected during both fixes, although much worse the second time when I lost all my green checks for images I had just placed. After reaching out, I was told my request would be put on hold and they would share more details with me when they were available. This was May 30. I have remained hopeful and waiting, checking my messages frequently just to make sure I didn’t miss one. Today, I find that they don’t plan on doing anything to help, and they certainly weren’t going to reach out with more details to me. Now, there is not even an option for me to reach out over the “Contact” thread in-game because there is no keyboard attached for me to use (what I can only assume is another bug).
Niantic should send this information to their players through the game. I wouldn’t be surprised if there are others like me waiting for answers to their requests without knowing this exists.
The response from @hpwulola / @HPWUTeam is an example of a terrible customer service. Some customers were directly affected by their acts. Their response and actions are a proof of sheer incompetence from a technical and a commmunication point of view.
Instead of missing fragments, imagine if they deleted your account. It's not a very distant scenario as they actually deleted part of your account. Would you be happy with "move on"? If you are, move on, leave this threads for those who are not willing to give up on their time and money invested in this piece of software.
Niantic and WB don't need advocates or white knights. They're grown up and they should be up for some criticism.
Stop harrassing those who are making justified complaints.. Don't tell others how they should feel when something is taken off their hands and the only response is "MOVE ON".
If you're happy, move on. Leave this for those who feel deceived by them.
So you're upset that those who are willing to move on are trying to convince those who aren't to stop posting the same thing over and over and to consider a different viewpoint. You see these people as white knights striving to protect the HPWU team. Fair enough, we're all entitled to an opinion in this matter.
But isn't it ironic that in the same post you're acting as a white knight to protect the group you agree with while trying to convince the other group to consider a different viewpoint?
Hi, we will be adding a complimentary pack to Diagon Alley. I'll have details of the contents tomorrow. Thank you for all your feedback and suggestions. We have determined that modifying players' registries can have unintentional negative effects and we are choosing not to take this risk.
Well modifying the registries is what got us into this mess in the first place. Wish you had thought about that earlier. It would be helpful to get a bit more detailed explanation of the negative effects. What could go wrong?
Why not keep the user offline, backup the users registry, modify it, then let them online again and if something goes wrong restore from the backup.
If it will take too much time and resources for you or that you don’t have any backups from the last fix, just be honest and say so. I think/guess/hope that you have spent quite some time digging into the issue, but it doesen’t stand out in your communication and a bit of clarification would be in place.
I suppose you found the forum option since you seem to ignore my posts.
@SaylerA is NOT assuming that any transaction data is available. We are hoping that a backup/snapshot is available (dating before the fix). This would be sufficient to restore green stars.
Even if no backup exists (🤦) some solutions for restoring green stars based on known data were presented here.
Where there's a will, there's a way.
You're at a restaurant, they burn your food or drop it, they tell you that sorry they are out of that food now. Instead of going to a different restaurant, you sit there and continually yell at them or tell them they need to change their food storage process. You're not getting that food there no matter what you do. Leaving the restaurant, giving them a bad review, and not eating there again sends the message.
Do you think they have not heard your complaints @sup3rfm ? I think they have. How many more times do you need to complain before you think they heard you?
I requested a refund through support yesterday given Apple said take it up with the developer. To their credit, they responded within 24 hours. The response was they will not consider refunds and they are still working on a fix. I have asked for clarification given we have been told here that no further work in a solution will be pursued.
@MissyWuwu - I have no comment to make on your posting hence no reply
I do not see your most recent post as reasonable - “We are hoping that a backup/snapshot is available (dating before the fix). This would be sufficient to restore green stars.“ Expecting a fix from a backup you hope exists...?
The known facts are there are (at least) two point in time backups and the current constantly evolving position. Without all the transaction data it is impossible to reconstruct or investigate what actually happened at any intervening point, and no mention has been made or log files which I may give contextual information too
I admire your optimism. There was will to fix the issue as evidenced by the (failed) attempt(s) and it may have been possible to do more *closer to the time of the issue occurring*. However, it appears the time has passed and we will never know if it were ever possible to correct the issue
@rocketj I love everything about that comment. Sadly no one seems to make that connection. Well said.